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AN INVESTIGATIVE NEWS SERIES ON THE STANDARDS AND PRACTICES OF THE BETTER BUSINESS BUREAU START WITH TRUTH |
| V 1.5 Nov 2010 | ||
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| SOME RECENT COMMENTS ABOUT THE BBB FROM ACROSS THE NATION | |
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| FROM WALLET POP
People have been taking advantage of easy membership in BBB so they can use their logo on promotional literature for at least 25 years. The BBB seal of approval means nothing to anybody that understands how their organization can be played.      2
11-26-2010 @ 6:17PM Marilyn Mell said...I feel I got scammed by the BBB. I doubt I will ever TRUST them again! What a shame that most of those establishments have become so corrupt!  6
I was the president of the Coastal Carolina branch and resigned. A vacation club company that had over 100 complaints threatened to sue due to the low rating we had given them. We were told to increase the rating to prevent the lawsuit by BBB National. BBB was at one time a valid organization but in todays world they are useless.  7
The bbb is pretty worthless.I had transmission work done at a shop with their logo and the buisness did the most crapass work a shop could do.The bbb sided with the business and I had to take the shop to small claims to recover.Alot of worthless outfits hide behind the logo designation as a boost to credibility.If someone boasts of being a member I dismiss them as one trying to hide something.  8
So far every commment has been right on the nose. The actual scammers are the BBB's themselves. We will NEVER list our business with these frauds again... There are a LOT of good Consumer Protective Agencies out there in local communities that are not-for-profit and staffed mainly by some very knowledgeable volunteers. These BBB clowns will call a reputable business like ours and leave a VERY ominous sounding message about how urgently we need to contact the BBB on a very important matter. Only to discover that they have got wind of our company and want us to join their little "pay to play" con-game. They should be shut down as they do absolutely NOTHING for the comsumer that several not for profits and municipal services do a hundred times better. People AVOID these scammers. You'll be better off and get far better referrals from the types of agencies I mentioned.  10
Yet another instance where an agency that, theoretically, is  13
Reading all of these comments validates what I have thought for years. I work for H&R Block and we got an F rating, which is completely bogus. H&R Block is not perfect, but a lot better than Jackson Hewitt, which got an A. I always thought they much have paid for that A.  14
After having a delivery problem with UPS on 3 different occasions, I filed a complaint with UPS, and got no where. So I then filed a complaint with the BBB, but I got no positive resolution on that complaint. The BBB asked me to rate UPS, so I gave them the lowest poor rating allowed. Six months later, I noticed UPS had a A+ rating with the BBB. Huh? If I gave them a terrible rating, how can UPS have a A+ rating. I have no faith or respect with the BBB.  15
11-26-2010 @ 11:43PM Fred Glynn said...Although this article was made to look like news, it is not news. That the BBB is useless and protects companies that work against their customers' best interests has been well known for over 40 years.  17
A
large, well-known multi repair company operating in and around Houston,
Texas displays their BBB seal for all to see. A representative of that
dishonest company told us we needed a completely new central air
conditioning unit. It turned out we only needed a new coil which was
under warranty. When we began questioning the rep about the outrageous
price and the necessity of the work, he couldn't get out of the house
fast enough. A company of liars, cheaters sanctioned by the BBB. Why am
I not surprised. rick
roget  
Melanie
D I had an issue with a franchise location of a national car repair/service chain. My complaint, which I opened with my area BBB, was transferred to the local BBB of the chain's headquarters. I was told that "this was how [chain name] required complaints against them to be handled because there are so many of them." Oh, really? This chain can boss the BBB around? The whole thing stunk to high heaven. Long story short, my complaint was never resolved to my satisfaction, in part because the chain did not respond to claims against franchisees, only the shops they directly owned. I have never trusted the BBB since. 
Bert
J. Miano Unfortunately, my experience with BBB convinced me that they are more interested in protecting paying members than consumers. The proof to me is that companies with numerous complaints who have been found liable for fraud through BBB arbitration are still highly ranked. Why? Because they are paying, accredited members. Even if good, honest businesses can sometimes earn high rankings, the real fraud is that the BBB refuses to downgrade its accredited members even after they've been proving to cheat customers. That is indefensible in my opinion, and makes the BBB worthless to consumers. Check out my blog post on this topic: http://arockforever 
Kevin
Bain The BBB is a pay-to-play organization. Scentura is high-ranked in BBB listings, and they've been busted for fraud countless times. Same with a number of other scam companies. An ethical business doesn't need BBB standing to convince its customers that it's honest. 
J.
E. C. Here's what we are being told here: do not trust the BBB. You can only trust the government to protect you. Frankly, I don't give a damn if the BBB discriminates against non-members. All I care is that they discriminate against shady businesses, and all evidence is that they do. In my own narrow experience, I found the BBB an invaluable resource in my years in the military, it being the best way to find a good local mechanic (or other service professional) quickly. 
drgarnett They shouldn't even be bothering to evaluate non-members, then. They are in essence telling people that BBB non-members are not as good as BBB members. That is worse than discrimination, it's misrepresentation. What you're really being told here is that you can't trust organizations that make you pay to play! 
Eric
Greenspan The BBB is a mess...I don't believe it started out this way, but its become an extortion tactic to get signups and fees. See my personal experience with the BBB here: http://www.ericgreenspan.com/me/better-business-bureau-for-who/ 
Kansas
City BBB In regards to the comments: Sometimes we will indeed tell people that there's nothing we can do. It not because we "take the company's side." These complaints mostly come from people who have signed contracts. If the consumer signs a really bad contract and gets taken advantage of, there's nothing we can do to stop it. They signed it. That's why we perpetually release tips, alerts, warnings, tweets, posts and blogs trying to get people not to do that. We work closely with consumer protection agencies and try to get these types of contracts banned or made illegal. That can happens through litigation that takes years. If an accredited business refuses to follow through on their end of a contract, we do the same thing to them and sometimes have to kick them out. Sometimes in the same day we get phone calls from businesses who say we "always" take the consumer's side and consumers claiming we "always" take the business's side. 
Matt
Davis Thank you for showing some guts. 
Tom
Wilson I am a paying member and also on the BBB local board. I think generally they are good people with good intentions. The issue which I expounded on below is how they are organized. They have 160 fiefdom's throughout the U.S. with little centralized control. If you read all the comments below, some people report good results and others have the opposite to say. They (the BBB) has too many individuals making their own rules. My prediction is without a fundamental change, they will cease to exist. I mean who under 30 has any idea what the BBB is about? They know McAfee, VeriSign, Comodo, etc. but not the BBB.
Samantha
Rogers Every young person I know knows what the BBB. Honestly until this article I thought it was a government organization, but I learned quite young that if a company tries to screw you over the BBB is always and option. 
Justin
Bowers Isn't it funny how this situation is almost the same as the credit-rating agencies and mortgage-backed securities? You'd almost come to the conclusion that doing business with firms over which you're supposed to provide oversight is not the best of ideas, especially for consumers. 
Cindy
Proctor The BBB now supports the business and not the consumer as I have had first-hand experience. They sided with the business who lied through their teeth. It was a total waste of time to pursue anything with them. Apparently, businesses are now buying into BBB and they support them, rather than the consumer. Wednesday,
December 08, 2010, 10:12:12 AM
– Flag
– Reply
Tom Wilson A FISH STINKS FROM THE HEAD By way of background I am a business executive, entrepreneur, consumer advocate, author and on the BBB local board. Since 2007, we conducted research with our customers (coast to coast) to help us better understand the effect the BBB logo has as a purchase motivator. Results of this study were forwarded to key leadership within the local and national BBB organization. We also prepared and forwarded a competitive analysis of the online “trust” business with recommendations for better defining the business the BBB is in - the "trust" business. This too was shared with local and national leadership. The 20/20 expose was certainly a major setback for the BBB brand, but it is only symptomatic of the BBB’s current command and control structure. Think about BBB as a brand with brand equity (like Tide detergent). A closer to home example would be McAfee, VeriSign, Comodo, etc. Think about what comes to mind to the average consumer when they hear or see "BBB". The truth is not much. Following is what is urgently needed to keep the BBB brand relevant. Otherwise, I'm confident that over time the brand will cease to exist. My recommendations are much broader than what Steve Cox is implementing. That is why I am writing to you and the board. • The #1 opportunity for the BBB brand is changing the organizational structure and creating a centralized command and control structure. • The #2 opportunity is reorganizing as a for profit as a stock company. The BBB is not organized to compete effectively in today's marketplace. A sale of the brand to a competitor should be considered (VeriSign, McAfee, etc.). • Significantly downsize the organization (offices/people). Having 160 offices with multiple President/CEO’s is inefficient and impractical. I’m sure none of the local leaders would agree. • Employ a qualified compensation expert like Hay Associates and overhaul the current compensation system. The current system would not work in a "for profit organization". Compensation equity and levels are a major issue in the current structure. • Hire a highly experienced branding or positioning consultant to define the business the BBB is in (the trust business) and how to properly position it for today's marketplace. The BBB brand needs to compete against a plethora of newer trust brands such as VeriSign, McAfee, Comodo and customer review sites such as a Trip Advisor, GetHuman, and others. These recommendations focus on the core organization and brand issues. Simply making adjustments to how the BBB implements a rating system across 160 decentralized offices is a tactical move and similar to rearranging the chairs on the deck of the Titanic. I feel that Steve Cox is simply not up to the task of leading the BBB under its current structure, let alone attempting to lead it into the future. 
Moonbat Those jackasses have called me repeatedly demanding money for a listing. Whatever their official position when their executives are talking to Congress, the line taken by their sales reps clearly links rating to membership. (For example: "You need a membership because otherwise you won't be able to defend yourself from malicious accusations that would lower your rating.") The best thing I can say about the BBB is that it's light years less corrupt than Dun & Bradstreet, who have also called me, but D&B had the unmitigated gall to tell me that they were KNOWINGLY publishing INACCURATE information, but would only correct it if I paid them $400. D&B is nothing but a protection racket. The BBB is merely useless, which is much better. 
Jesse Just last week I got an email from an obvious spammer offering me the privilege of buying a domain name that was similar to another that I own for 50 times the price it would normally cost if the spammer didn't have a temporary hold on it. I googled this guy and among a dozen blog entries exposing the spammer as a fraud, there was the result giving his BBB rating: an A-. He must be a member.
Samantha
Rogers If you pay him does he give you the product you paid for? If so, then he isn't a fraud he's just holding a scarce commodity (that paticular domain name).
Citizen
++ Local BBBs can be helpful to consumers, but the National BBB has become the worst of the worst special interests in Congress fighting for corporate tax breaks, big oil, and union busting that is destroying the middle class and working families. High rollers with some of their own questionable human rights history including Apple, Nike, and Toyota have left the national BBB because its been getting so bad.
janes_kid I had always just assumed that [T]he Better Business Bureau a protection racket since I first tried to get some assistance from them in, perhaps, 1968. Am I a prophet or has it always been this way?
Mitbert
Strangejoy If you've been defrauded, you'd probably do much better writing to the FTC and your state AG than to the BBB. If your state AG is a Democrat, they're likely to be your best bet. I'm not trying to be partisan here, but consumer protection suits from state AGs are almost entirely brought by Democrats.
Bill
Collins The BBB is a racket. I have twice tried to use them in complaints against companies and in both instances their stock answer was "the company has met our guidelines and we consider the matter satisfactorily closed." No amount of letter writing or telephoning will get the BBB to move off that position. I told the local BBB manager that if he was putting the interests of the dues payers over the public and essentially lying about what service they perform. That was in 2007. Nothing has changed. 
Melanie
D Same thing happened to me. Plus they transferred my complaint to the local BBB of the national headquarters of the company in question, which was totally sketchy. 
karl I was able to resolve service issues with two companies through complaints with the BBB. In both cases, the companies were unresponsive until the complaints were filed. Then both resolved the issues to my satisfaction. Based on these experiences, I stand by the BBB and the consumer protections they provide.
faxmebeer The only people I have ever heard mention the BBB are complainers; I have never heard from a customer who said they chose us because of BBB research. When a complainer tells me the are calling the BBB, I could honestly not care less, since they are only going to talk to other whiners who don't bother to understand what they are buying before they do buusiness. We need a better consumer beureau, to tell the truth. Bowl
Weevils
The BBB was useless to me. They couldn't even get Uverse to address my concerns in writing when I told them that one of my concerns was that Uverse's representatives provide inaccurate information over the phone, and because I was on painkillers and did not want to engage in phone negotiations with a professional negotiator while not in peak mental condition. Uverse just kept refusing to respond in writing and telling me to call them. BBB kept saying "sorry we can't achieve a resolution". As far as I can tell, I don't think anyone at the BBB even looked at the complaint.
daedalus Say what you want about the BBB, but if you have a problem with a company, a complaint to the BBB really gets things done. I have been astonished at how quickly a company will respond with apologies and solutions after a complaint to the BBB-- even after repeated complaints directly to the company were completely ignored. And then the BBB will follow up with you to make sure it was properly handled. The grading system sounds suspect, but the way they advocate on behalf of consumers is top notch. 
Julia Now I haven't seen this happen. I've filed numerous complaints and basically been told to "solve it myself". Or have gotten "arbitration" that automatically sides with the company in question. (Such as, "I bought X from you that broke instantly. I tried to take it back, couldn't. I complained. BBB said they'd arbitrate. The arbitrator said 'obviously you broke it, and are causing problems'.") Seriously. I'd 100% agree that BBB is a protection racket and that you really can't trust their ratings as far as you can throw them.
daedalus Weird. Maybe the regional offices are different? I've used the BBB in my city and always had great results.
John
Kennel Well, obviously it would vary from city to city (and from case to case), since each office appears to be operated more or less independently. 
Sahel
Chen I agree. I have been fighting with Tmobile for more than a year over their crappy service. I finally broke down and wrote the bbb a letter 2 weeks ago. I got a response two days ago, informing me that Tmobile was letting me out of my contract (without a fee).
Nexus7 > Too bad the BBB can't lay down a couple hundred to buy membership in ABC News, the L.A. Times, or the Connecticut attorney general's office. Wait a sec now. They can get a pretty good plug on Fox for a few of their morals and 2 quid. BBB has contacted me many times to join ( for a hefty fee of course) and when I questioned the person on the phone about irregularities in the news about the rating system, she said a supervisor would call me ( guess what not one call again) no follow up to join–guess that’s one way to stop the harassing phone calls to join BBB  mentman says: Good article George, [...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by George Gombossy, Katrina Britt and others. Katrina Britt said: Blumenthal's BBB Investigation: Made For TV | Connecticut Watchdog: In late September ABC TV's 20/20 began inves… http://bit.ly/feojYp [...]  George Gombossy says: I loved your story on BBB. I also see that Mister Bill Rappoport is the principle.
Bill is the son of Norman Rappoport who was on the Board of directors
at BBB years ago. Is their anything shady going on here? They seem to being D/B/A American Foods but BBB reports them
as American Frozen Foods Inc. which was the name when I worked for
them. I’m just trying to get the monies that they held in the
80′s and were paying about 13% at that time. I wrote them in the
80′s and was told I would receive the funds 1 year after I left then I
was told that I had to wait till I was 55 and here I am at 59 years old
with no funds yet.
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| Editor's
note:
There
is
a
need
for
a
consumer
advocacy
group
that
the
public
can
turn
to,
and
it
used
to be that the Better Business
Bureau fulfilled this role adequately. No longer. It is
obvious the Better
Business Bureau does not now, nor ever will have, the resources to
fully investigate the four million businesses in their database, much
less grade them with any sense of accuracy. It's an impossible
job,
and to think otherwise is a mistake that the BBB should acknowledge so
they can get back to their reason for existence--protecting the
consumer. There's an old saying, "who will watch the watchers"
and it
applies here as the BBB has set themselves up to be above the
law. We
are simply here to help the Better Business Bureau do a better job so
that they may properly serve the consumer, the business community and
themselves. If they refuse to reform, then they must bear the
consequences. |
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| ©
2009-2010 bbbroundup.com. all rights reserved. |
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It’s ok George. Those of us in CT for any length of time, know that Blumenthal is nothing but a media whore constantly seeking the camera! We know how he “investigates”. YOU keep up the good work. He’ll be GONE from here VERY soon!
Thanks CT Voters! You got rid of the media whore by sending him to America’s County Club (The Senate). Now he can grandstand and torment the whole country. I would have rather seen McMann or Schiff over this admitted prevaricator.
Between you guys and the voters in Alaska we really do have the government we deserve.
Don’t blame ME! I DIDN’T vote for him!